The Communion of Saints

  1. Romans 12:4-5

    1 Corinthians 12:12-13

    (Rom)For as in one body we have many members, and not all the members have the same function, so we, who are many, are one body in Christ, and individually we are members one of another

    (1 Cor) For just as the body is one and has many members, and all the members of the body, though many, are one body, so it is with Christ
  2. Romans 8:38-39

    For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor rulers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to seperate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord
  3. Ephesians 2:15-16

    He has abolished the law with its commandments and ordinances, so that he might create in himself one new humanity in place of the two, thus making peace, and might reconcile both groups to God in one body through the cross, thus putting to death that hostility through itl
  4. Ephesians 4:4

    There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to the one hope of your calling, one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is above all through all and in all
  5. Ephesians 1:22-23

    And he has put all things under his feet and has made him the head over all things for the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills all in all
  6. Col 1: 18, 24

    (Col 1:18) He is the head of the body, the church

    (Col 1:24) I am now rejoicing in my suffering for your sake, and in my flesh I am completing what is lacking in Christ's afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, his church.
  7. Just as we can pray for one another, we can suffer for one another as Paul says in Col 1:24
  8. Objections to Catholic Teaching

    A. Contrary to Deuteronamy 18: 10-12
    (Deut) No one shall be found among you who makes a son or daughter pass through fire, or who practises divination, or is a soothsayer, or an augur, or a sorcerer, or one who casts spells or who consults ghosts or spirits, or who seeks oracles from the dead.

    • 1. Misunderstanding of Scripture; this is about the occult
    • 2. Misunderstanding of Catholic practice and teaching; Catholics do not use mediums, spiritists etc. to "call up the dead"
    • 3. Saints in heaven are "alive", Mt 22:31-32 God is the God of the Living!
    • 4. Mt 17:1-4, Elijah and Moses "appear" to Jesus and 3 disciples
  9. Objections to Catholic Teaching

    Terminology: "Prayer" to Mary or "Prayer" to the Saints...
    "Prayer" to Mary or "Prayer" to the Saints is NOT worshipping them, it is asking or requesting their prayers and intercession.

    E.g, "I pray thee, brothers and sisters, pray for me."
  10. Objections to Catholic Teaching

    Saints in Heaven can't hear us or see us, therefore, we cannot pray to them
    1. Saints in Heaven do not have the same limitations that we have on Earth...

    Rev 21:21 And the twelve gates are twelve pearls, each of the gates is a single pearl, and the street of the city is pure godl, transparent as glass

    1 Cor 13:12 For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then we will see face to face. Now I know only part; then I will know fully, even as I have been fully known.

    1 Cor 15:49 Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we will also bear the image of the man of heaven

    2 Peter 1:4

    1 Cor 2:9 But as it is written, 'What no eye has seen, nor ear heard, nor the human heart conceived, what God has prepared for those who love him --
  11. God reveals certain knowledge to angels and saints in Heaven,
    1 Cor 2:10,

    Rev 6:9-10,

    1 Sam 28:8-19

    Lk 16: 19-31
    1 Cor 2:10

    Rev 6:9-10 When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the sould of those who had been slaughtered for the word of God and for the testimony they had given; they cried out with a loud voice, "Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long will it be before you judge and avenge our blood on the inhabitants of the earth?

    1 Sam 28:8-19 ....The Lord has done to you just as he spoke by me; for the Lord has torn the kingdom out of your hand and given it to your neighbour David. Because you did not obey the voice of the Lord, and did not carry out his fierce wrath against Amalek, therefore the Lord has done this thing to you today. Moreover the Lord will give Israel along with you into the hands of the Philistines; and tomorrow you and your sons shall be with me...

    Luke 16: 19-31 ...He called out "Father Abraham have mercy on me, and send Lazarus to dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue...
  12. Angels and Saints, to some extent, know what's in a person's heart and mind,

    Luke 15: 7-10,

    Matthew 22: 29-30,

    Hebrews 12:1
    Luke 15: 7-10 Just so, I tell you, there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous people who need no repentance....(10) Just so, I tell you, there is joy in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.

    Matthew 22: 29-30 Jesus answered them, "You are wrong, because you know neither the scriptures nor the power of God. For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven.

    Hebrews 12:1 Therefore, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us also lay aside every weight and the sin that clings so closely, and let us run with perseverance the race that is set before us
  13. Objections to Catholic Teaching

    Prayer to Mary and the Saints is attributing God-like power to them
    1. Example of left hand sticking right hand with needle, all impulses first go through the brain

    2. All prayer first goes through Christ, everything is through Him, with Him, and in Him; Mary and the Saints have no power of their own.
    • 1. Saints in Heaven are alive, not dead
    • 2. Saints and angels in Heaven have some knowledge of events, present and future, on Earth; and some knowledge of interior dispositions
    • 3. This knowledge is not of their own power, it is only through Jesus Christ
  15. Objections to Catholic Teachings

    Why waste your time praying to Saints when you can go straight to Jesus?
    1. Why waste your time asking me for prayer when you can go straight to Jesus?

    2. Misunderstanding - you cannot go to the saints without first going to Jesus

    3. Prayer of a righteous man is "powerful and effective"

    James 5: 16 Therefore confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, so that you may be healed. The prayer of the righteous is powerful and effective

    1 Peter 3:12 For the eyes of the Lord are on the righteous, and his ears are open to their prayer. But the face of the Lord is against those who do evil.

    • Hebrews 12:22-23 But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to innumerable angels in festal gathering, and to the assembly of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven, and to God the judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect
    • Job 42: 7-10
    • Exodus 17: 8-13

    4. If there are no righteous ones on Earth (Romans 3:10), and therefore, according to Protestant argument, Mary was not sinless, who was James talking about in 5:16?

    5.) Saints in Heaven love us and want to pray for us, "Love never ends..." (1 Cor 13:8)
  16. Biggest objection to Catholic Teaching...

    1 Tim 2:5, Jesus' role as "sole mediator between God and Man"
    1. Catholics agree that Jesus is the "sole mediator between God and man". Jesus is the only one who is true God and true man, only by Jesus' blood are we saved, but, as members of Jesus' Body, we can share in His role as mediator and as He allows us to

    2. Moses, Abraham, Job are examples of mediation and intercession between God and man; praying for one another here on earth is an example of mediating and interceding between God and man

    3. 1 Tim 2:5 is being misinterpreted

    4. Only one foundation, Jesus: 1 Cor 3:11. Yet, other foundations: Eph 2:19-20, Rev 21:14

    5. Only one Lord, Jesus: Eph 4:4-5. Yet, other lords: Rev 19:16, 1 Peter 3:6

    6. Only one judge, Jesus: James 4:12, 2 Tim 4:1. Yet, other judges: 1 Cor 6:2, Lk 22:28-30

    7. Only one Father, God: Mt 23:9. Yet, other fathers: Acts 7:2, Acts 22:1, 1 Cor 4:15

    8. Only one teacher, Jesus: Mt 23: 6-8 (NKJV). Yet, other teachers: Acts 13:1, 1 Cor 12:28

    9. More examples of intercessors/mediators: Mt 18:10, Rev 5:8, Rev 8:3-4
    Scripture tells us there is only one Foundation, only one Lord, only one Judge, only one Father, only one Teacher, just as it tells us there is one Mediator, yet, Scripture also shows us that there is more than one judge, more than one foundation, more than one lord, more than one judge, more than one father, more than one teacher. Does scripture contradict itself? No! Jesus is the head of the Body. Jesus grants different members of the Body the graces to share in His role as foundation, as lord, as judge, as father, as teacher, and yes, as mediator. The members of the Body are allowed...though, with, and in Jesus share in the grace and glory of the Head, Jesus Christ. And, as we have seen, Scripture is full of examples of people sharing in the mediation of Christ.
Card Set
The Communion of Saints
The Communion of Saints roots in scripture